INTERVIEW WITH VIVIANE CHEN:
DATE: March 1, 2007
INTERVIEWER: Linda Milks
PLACE: Saratoga, CA
-Yes, the transcript needs editing but I believe it is more important to post the content as is rather than hold it back...LM
Viviane was born in Shanghai and lived for a while in Hong Kong and Taiwan before moving to the US at age 12.
She rents a rustic cottage in the Santa Cruz Mountains surrounded by redwood and oak trees. The cottage was built a few decades ago by some forest service men who needed a place stay while working in the area. There is a gate at the roadside which must be opened & closed when entering into the woods where she and a few others live. A rather long, unpaved driveway leads to her cottage which is totally off the grid with electricity coming from solar panels and propane gas.
There is a small kitchen and bathroom which opens up into a larger living area. The focal point of this room is a puja or alter space. Pictures of Buddhist monks and meditating figures draw my attention and add to the quiet ambiance of her home. She also has a puja outside as well and before we began, we went there to offer gratitude and prayers.
I arrive at 10:30am and it is close to 3:30pm before I leave. The time flew by and was punctuated by a delicious lunch she prepared for us – she made the best scallion pancakes I have ever tasted!
Her professional training was in architecture originally, receiving a degree from the University of Michigan. She works now as a Feng Shui practitioner and in Energy / Space Clearing. I see this as being the other side of the coin of her early training. Instead of preparing a space for a physical structure, she now works with the subtle energies of a space, both interior and exterior, helping to release stuck and stagnant energy.
(Parts of the tape were interrupted. I unfortunately lost about 20 minutes of our interview however none was lost during out time with the oak tree. My apologies -.LM)
Vivian is very friendly and gracious for giving me all of this time and also introducing me to others for this project. She had also prepared some notes of stories prior to my arrival so she would have some stories fresh in her mind.
I have a friend who can speak to and hear the spirits more easily than I can.
So on New Years Day I asked this friend to confirm some messages that the spirits that came gave me. They said, ‘Oh, we love it keep sending us more love. And don’t just radiate the love to us and to this cottage and to this area radiate it to the surrounding communities, radiate it immeasurably. So this practice, which in your practice I’m sure you’ve done it or encountered it, it’s such a powerful practice you know.
So this is something that the trees actually told you?
Yes, well, I don’t know if it’s trees …tape cuts off…
(Then the interview with the oak tree, Wilson, cuts in on the tape. NOTE: :)
We asked his name while with him on site but we got the message that he does not have a name. A few days later I receive an email from Viviane and she told me his name is Wilson!)
Linda Narrates: We are with an old oak tree that dominates a clearing in the back of Viviane’s yard. Her cottage is surrounded by redwoods but in back is a spacious clearing.
(We have brought a couple of plastic chairs out and placed them by the tree. It is a bit chilly but I don’t mind.)
(Viviane says to the oak tree) First she says that he said “it’s all about love”.
Are you happy that summer is coming? And he said ‘no, I’m just happy to be here and wait for things to happen.’
(Viviane asks me: do you want to try asking the tree yourself?
Yes, I say. I put my face up against the tree and think of what to ask. My mind is blank and I can’t think of an appropriate question. I’m scrolling trough my thoughts but nothing comes to mind that I think is right for the moment.. So for a couple minutes I just sit there with my face against the tree saying nothing.)
He just said to me: ‘listen to my trunk and listen to how deep my roots go. And then he said,’ my roots go so deeply it goes beyond the physical. _____________?_____(we wait for @ 1 minute before she resumes) He said, ‘people want to hear about sorrows or something spicy. Let’s just talk about love. Let’s just feel every moment out there. _________?___
How old are you? Maybe 800 year’s old.?
I don’t know anything about the size of oak trees and their trunks.
(To the tree) How come you get to be king of the meadow?
Can you explain that? Did he just say that he was king of the meadow?
No, I was just looking around and I was saying ‘how come he happened to be here to myself and that when they cleared the land they respected his presence. And I looked at that other tree that was nice and big and so I was asking him,’ How did he get to be king of the meadow?’
The Oak tree replied: “Some of us have all the luck!”.
(We are chuckling at this…)
Is that what he said?
That’s what I think he said. This is a humorous tree. He’s having fun with us. But he feels so good to me. How does he feel to you?
He feels like a father. The term grandfather came to mind. Solid. Strong. Integrity.
And somewhere these thoughts were passing through my head and it was a conversation going on and: he has gotten this way, he has been able to endure this long because of the lovingness. That’s his strength. .
Peace and solidness, that’s what I mean, they convey not in words but in feelings and in flavors and in sensibilities I guess.
(The tape jumps to a previous conversation which took place inside, not with the oak tree)
You know man and trees have a symbiosis of course, the oxygen and carbon… And as a child I always enjoyed the woods. One of the first things this Chinese Chi Gung master taught me was to see the other realm and looking at chi on the ocean, just that flittering of energy.
When I was translating, and introduced some friends who had breast cancer, he said Oh – he worked on her by using chi and he worked by holding whatever it is, and pushing out whatever needed to be pushed out of her system and then instructing her in meditation.
He gave her a meditation with trees. He said to sit with a Yew tree or a certain kind of tree and start to cycle the energy. And so this in China is the known way to work with breast cancer.
And the instruction was to sit next to the tree consciously moving your energy into the tree and have it cycle back in with the tree energy?
Yes a yew tree and another kind of tree that I can’t remember. Sitting with the tree, talking with the tree, hugging…Cycling your energy, adding like someone without oxygen would add an oxygen tank and now you’ve integrated the tree and for specific periods of time.
And then my intuitive friend from Nicaragua said, “Oh yes, the spiritual people in South America have this.” So this is a common practice, I think, in primitive and simple societies with those who are more connected to nature.
So that’s one of the first things that Mark would suggest…and when we went to walk in the forest he would actively encourage us to exchange energy with the trees. To bring some awareness into it, not just say oh, I love the trees etc…..But start on a deeper level which requires listening and it requires; in many chi gung practices it is actually moving your center of energy between you and the universe, whatever is in the universe.
But as soon as I arrived there was this very tall stump of a tree with just a branch and it obviously looked like it was going. And she (the woman of the house) said, ‘Oh I’m so glad you’re here today, they’re removing this tree today which is obviously sick and dying and it needs to be taken care of. But we feel so bad, and their poor little Irish kids – boys and girls - and she asks me what do I recommend?
I said OK, well I don’t see but I can feel and I can talk. The way to treat a situation like this is it’s not so much the tree that I need to talk with, they are the host, and it’s that they are the housing for the poor spirits that haven’t decided what to do yet…..so lets just hold out our hand and invite them to the nearest tree or a tree that you feel would be suitable for them.
So we invited them immediately to the plum tree right below it. I didn’t know it was a plum, there were hardly any leaves, I knew it was some sort of a fruit tree. We had our space clearing and everything ended and at the end of that, a month later, I get a very excited call about the plum tree. (the house owner calls & says) “This plum tree, we’ve had it for 6-7 years and it’s never given us but 3-5 little old plums that look like they need food and are very minimal. And this year we have baskets of plums! They were so joyful, it was a validation.
The tree that you took the spirits from, it was a big tree, and then you transferred them to a plum tree which is smaller and a fruit and flowering tree. Will the spirits from the larger tree be happy living with the smaller, different tree?
Well, after inviting I was opening myself and I went, “Aahh”, and my eyes were glazing and it lighted on that tree so I made myself open and it picked a tree through me. It was like, ‘Oh , Oh thank you! This would be nice, thank you very much, this will be nice!’ Thank you for being polite!
Because it did occur to me in a flash, Ooo, that’s such a giant, regal tree but now it’s a stump and the poor spirit was still hanging on in there. This less elevated tree, it was a plum tree it wasn’t a huge tree you know. It’s like those redwoods and we would toss it into something like a cherry tree. But it was quite happy to be there!
They were quite happy with the family and you know they were Irish and when I work with the Irish I find they are very naturally attuned with the nature elements.
And what year did you do that?
End of 1998, early 1999.
OK. Is there a certain season that is better for transferring spirits from one place to another?
I’m called on emergencies so I only know about it this way. I believe they find their own – but I think when we own property we have to remember the concept of stewardship. And so when we own property; -in Nature when a tree fell, not in a populated area, the spirit would have to go find another tree, yeah?
So when a tree falls and it becomes fodder, it will disintegrate eventually after many years, there are still spirits though that stay with the tree as they go through their disintegration cycle.
They might. I wouldn’t know that. I haven’t had an experience about that but they might, that’s certainly possible. I’m thinking that these people were particularly removing the tree because it was a very small property, it was diseased, they didn’t have any choice, and they were attuned enough to nature to be disturbed by it.
So in that particular situation the spirit probably wanted them to know, to give them the opportunity to be more connected, and the spirit was happy so it waited. I mean it probably could have gone off on it’s own and found something too. But they are fond of what they make their home in.
And it’s also sad to see if there’s abuse on some level.
There is something I need to clarify. It’s the impersonal nature of this; and yet nature spirits have feelings…
When you were talking about that - that’s why you’re here. We’re here to get you through this impersonal issue. ( we laugh-..)
I don’t know directly always from personal experience to validate it but I’ve read many spiritual books – and so here’s my experience too, validated through my experience, but I couldn’t know it truly as a truth for you. So you can take it with a grain of salt.
In the unseen world there are all levels of being. When I make offerings to speak to the spirit of the land, because I am a feng shui practitioner, they are my guides and my assistants and they offer themselves as help so we are connecting and being polite and honoring.
It is said that it’s not the higher beings, who are very impersonal you know, they help but they’re not caught up in our way, so impersonal is not a negative. But there are lots of evolved unseen beings and in the unseen world there are some who are quite mean and mischievous. More like a raccoon, less like a butterfly. (we laugh)
It’s reflected through-out our natural world. And so you have the offerings and when it becomes more personal it’s more like a raccoon, you know. I don’t like my space or I don’t like this… and then they might get attached, and then the higher beings, the more evolved or refined, and what you offer to them is…But all beings love, Love- Is what they tell us. There is not a single being that doesn’t love Love.
Do you know who Michael Roads is? He’s an Australian man who has written several books. He says that: “Love is not an emotion, love is the creative aspect of the universe working through us.”
Sounds good. There is a Buddhist definition of two states of love. One is meta and the other for compassion, karuna??. And in meta, at least in the Pali Sanskrit words, as I have been told is a kind of love like a mother for a child as an object.
Compassion, the higher levels of love, have no object. It is just that state of being that is part of creation. And in that state, as you go through your life you can remember periods where you’re just in tune with- like a flowing river, you are just in love with everything around you and it is not even what you call an ordinary love. It doesn’t move you like an object. Right?
I agree. I like that distinction.
So we are moving ourselves to states where there is not even an object to love.
Within the past 3-4 years, a woman told me she had rheumatoid arthritis.
She had had RA for 10 years and she noticed that whenever she left her home she felt better than when she was in her home. And could I help her?
She lived in East Palo Alto and was of African American decent. I said well, when your immune system is so compromised we can certainly make some difference but whether it’s enough difference for you to actually recognize…because land and energy have their own micro-climates and if this land never had too much harmony, we can release and allow harmony to get to maybe a “C” level or a “B” level.
But because of her illness she maybe needs an “A+” environment, you know? Something that will nurture her instead of having to do a lot of work to just maintain, especially when her immune system is so compromised. So, we work on it. And when I got there she told me that just before I arrived, a tree that had been leaning on the left side of her site had been leaning so badly it finally fell. And it fell on a fruit tree, and that tree then fell almost onto their house. It was the middle of the night and they realized they could be dead.
This was due to a storm?
Mmm, it might have been. This was quite a few years ago, more like in 2000, 2001, or 2002, somewhere around there.
It was a fascinating thing. I was checking the earth veins and the earth vein was going that way (points to a direction) And I asked ‘which way was the tree leaning?’ So the tree was leaning in reception, like it was being pushed, like it was resisting a huge force. And all the years it was leaning until it was leaning too much and it had to fall. And so I found one node there and then another node, so 2 nodes in the house, and as we went out and looked at it, - and I saw every place was green but this one patch of ground was brown. And I looked at it and the woman said: “Yes, whenever I plant flowers here nothing grows.” And I was checking and she said, “yes, this is where the tree was.”
They had trimmed the stump of the tree down quite low so it wasn’t something that I immediately saw. There were no shavings so it looked just like dirt that nothing grew on.
It looked barren, there were very clear emotions and feelings that come up as depression. The woman said that she had tried to plant flowers there, seedling after seedling but nothing ever grows there. And this is true with geographic stress so that tree was absorbing and absorbing and finally went whomp. And it killed a little tree and that went down. So, I was clearing the stress and went into the house.
I tuned into this one clock that was from Jamaica and this was a clock that had belonged to someone that was a voodoo doctor. This had mojo in it. And then she was talking about how they had an African talking drum, they had more than one, because they liked to go to Africa and her husband loved these. A talking drum is something that just crackles on its own – it’s the skins tension and when the weather changes it will move and resound. It was definitely a shamanic drum.
So what I found there was a triangulation and the least and the most addressable was the force from the tree; the big force that the tree was absorbing. And the next easiest was the shamanic drums. So I cleared the tree and I cleared that. I was trying to release the triangle of power; because the most powerful was the voodoo clock.
Because if I went to clear the clock first it would have such a force! So it was like untying a knot at the edges and then it was easier to get to the heart. And it was definitely confirmed – they said it was very possible because they had some connection to how they got the clock, they knew where it was from – an old relative, family member…
When we cleared the clock everything eased up. And I said to her, what you will notice is that you will feel more relaxed. And she asked if it was enough. I said whatever it is, you’re going to find it easy to make your decisions. And less than a month later she called me and said, “I’ve made my decision, I’m moving to Florida, without any difficulty, without any regret. And I do feel better and I’ve made my decision. “
The release of force is something we have to be aware of in Nature, that there are energies like that.
But the fascinating thing was the clock and the drum are metaphysical energies that can latch onto a geophysical energy that the tree had been responding to. And who knows, if the metaphysical energy isn’t actually activating the geophysical energy.
I’ve seen that mind patterns are like grids of force in nature and use those grids to tap energies, just energy. That earth force is just neutral. If a good intention comes and wants to use it, or if a negative one comes.
Can you speak a little bit about how you did the Clearing.
Yes. I simply stand on the location that is relevant. i.e. near the clock, near the stump of the tree, right on it – it’s specific, and I’m going to a place where I feel deeply in harmony, at peace and acceptance and willingness.
And if you practice you become like a clear channel. So one aspect is my own love but when we become really clear channels - Deva’s are working with us, universal energy is moving through us, it’s very powerful. And of course always keeping in our intention…
The natural phenomenon of that is a mother and a child. The child falls. The mother is an inexperienced mom, it’s her first baby and she doesn’t have good experiences about falling and she panics. And the child will simply react to the environment and get more disturbed…
When the child is disturbed and the people around it are stable and comforting and confident, that child will release wherever they are.
And when they’re not, then the child hangs onto it longer.
So you’re saying that when you go into a calm, clear space and become a channel it allows the earth energy to release.
It allows disturbances to unlock and release.
And you set that intention.?
I simply go to an empty, peaceful place.
Oh, so you don’t even set an intention?
No. Maybe I carry the general benevolence with my intention all the time. I’m just going into vibrations.
Sometimes I do specifically but I don’t always. The general intention there is very benevolent, just to be in peace. Yes, it’s literally like playing a note of music. You don’t have to have an intention, all the things vibrational will recognize that note of music and relax and relax and relax…
Oh! Is that how you do it with everything? Did you do that with the clock and the talking drum?
Yes, but some things you might want to talk to a little bit more, like if there are spirits in a place or in a tree I would definitely talk. I tend to talk aloud but internally would be enough. And talking is just giving assurance and saying, you know this is the situation here and it’s not so supportive for you to be here but what’s the problem?
You know just go into a spaciousness where I’ve been told it’s like our body. And I certainly feel it exactly like that. That’s how I envision it that someone might know something more deeply. It’s like our body and we tense our muscle repeatedly and it’s just a knot. And then someone comes and pushes the right way or even energetically touches it because they have a really loving touch and ahhh – then we release and we can feel and then we’re back into our true state.
So you could say that everything is about getting back into the true state. And when we’re in a true state everything else resounds to its true state.
Is it possible, and has this happened to you, that when you go to clear a place in Nature and something is so powerful that you can’t release it or get to the place you need to get to within yourself to clear it?
I’m very cautious in this way. If I’m sick, I don’t do any work. And I have guidance that really helps me. For some people they’re not so lucky or maybe it’s their lesson, that they encounter things that truly traumatizes them. I have on one occasion in my life met a lance of a danaga??
And I cleared the whole house of this contractor paid to do the front door, I opened it and it went, whaaaap! (she laughs) It was like a soccer punch, right to my solar plexus.! And I didn’t work for 2 weeks.
It was a learning lesson, excuse me naga! , I was working on the back and it was partly, hmm, it was a learning curve thing. These people had had their house feng shuied before, 10 years ago. They were contractors and it was in Berkeley and the fascinating thing is that the house was immaculate. And the back yard was neat but the garage was crumbling and all rotted out.
So we were hanging out the back working with the land energies when I normally would have started at the front door. This was really in the Berkeley Hills, right in the hill and I had gotten into the space of some naga that really wanted me to know who ruled the roost!! (Laughs)
So did the naga actually leave the house and go into your body?
I believe it still lives on that land and it just gave me a soccer punch to let me know and teach me to have it in my intention and rather than running to every place and talking to – I have it in my intention from past experience to be polite…I might not on all occasions call up the naga because it’s not necessary, there may not be a naga living there. I don’t go through a routine but it occurs to me because I am doing the work.
At my friend’s restaurant in Houston I knew immediately that there was a lancet??? The thoughts of lancet??? are coming my way – I think, what’s that about? Oh oh yes… So that’s the way I work so that the appropriate information is always coming to me.
In fact when I go to a place I can use a dowsing rod to clear a place. But I notice that if I do nothing, my body walks itself right over there. As long as I’m not rigid I am the dowsing rod. It’s going to all the places that need a little love. That’s why they are saying it’s about being very aware and conscious of sending love. And that’s like something big is brushing me…
Are you OK – do you want to go on and focus on trees?
Yes, I’m fine. Trees are very powerful. And very often when I am clearing homes in a very sad and depressed energy… You know some tree stumps never die and people build right over them. So I’ll come into houses where the deck or even the living room would be right over a stump. People are not aware of this and it’s too much money to dig it up and the trees weren’t taken out. So that’s’ why people say to take a tree out completely with all of its roots. It leaves an energetic mark.
Very often part of my work is native so to speak, praying over the lost one’s that don’t have anyone to pray for them. These are native souls that drag me to tree souls. Because Native Americans were vary attuned to their environment and many, many shamans created their sacred circles with a deity??? that was marked by a tree. So very often, in the beginning, I would find disturbed trees. That I certainly felt were in need of release. These were powerful tree spirits.
When you say in the beginning what does that refer to?
Of my work. I found a lot of big old tree stumps – and they were introducing themselves to me. There was no shaman, just big old tree stumps and when I tuned in I could actually see the beautiful tree that had once stood there, some 800 year old trees, magnificent oaks; and the releasing of that. And sometimes they were taken down because of the community and sometimes they had a sad ending – there was emotion or disturbance.
Later on what I noticed was that I would find a nature disturbance and eventually end up with a disturbance from a shaman. So there was a synergy of the nature elements and the ancient people who lived on this land.
They were not apart from each other, they very much worked together and appreciated each other and I think the shamans often picked sites with powerful tree spirits and would make it their sacred circle. And then time moved on, things changed and they died; sometimes peaceably sometimes through invasion.
Sometimes due to native conflict or through foreigners coming in…Whatever happened, the general pattern would be that I would find a nature disturbance or a shamanic sacred spot and there would be trees there – the two go hand in hand.
And you could clear one and then you had to clear the other; through consciousness and through intention there. I wasn’t just clearing the shamanic and leaving the tree disturbance, I opened my space for both.
I’m more diffuse now, I just go in, open my space and everyone moves through. But in the learning curve I was much more specific, I needed to be much more specific.
What was the benefit of clearing the shamanic circle energies?
It seems like they would be a positive force.
Because many of the shamans were disturbed by how the land was handled. So at one place there would be loggers who drank a lot and the shamans felt this site was desecrated. And at some sites like this they are still connected to the land and at others they are ready to turn it over.
Now I want to make this very clear. I don’t go in and just clear. I go in harmony and allow whatever is ready to be released, release.
But because you are in harmony and are willing to accept, they show themselves to you, they trust you. And the deva’s and the angelic beings come and help release them.
So why clear? Because their disturbance reverberates into everything.
If there is a chi disturbance that is significant enough, nothing in that household can be happy. And in that particular spot is always a negative flow, a downward flow, downward vortex and a depressed sense.
Quite often old tree sites will pull the energy downward. And then you want to allow it to neutralize and be in total harmony. Sometimes you can allow a soft upward force, welcome a soft upward force because it’s natural in the earth, the earth vortex energies. And then people can heal themselves or refresh themselves.
So for me the trees first introduce themselves to me individually and then it’s shown to me how they would...
I want to make sure I’m clear. You would release the shamanic power spot because there were still some human souls there that had been disturbed because the land was being desecrated.
I am not releasing like the way you think. It is in partnership. I am standing there as a point of focus to allow. They are the ones doing the releasing. I do nothing except hold a space. I am simply holding a space so that those who want to release can. And sometimes we talk to each other – oh, very happy, I’m glad that you came.
And so there might be a head shaman and there would be 15, 20 100 lost souls. And it’s like, OK, use this pathway to release. Use this safe spot to be one with the universe again. Wherever they go, I can’t tell you that.
But whatever is happening, there is gratitude, there is an exchange, and sometimes I ask, ‘do you still wish to be connected with this land, this site, and is it still sacred to your people’? “No, we’re ready to let it go and turn it over. Or, no we still have living members who still wish for it to be sacred.” So this is an open dialogue not an intention.
They often will disturb things, and Nature spirits will disturb things enough so that people will come and get them the right help.
It’s co-creation. It’s never about going to do and I think that the real power rests in that place; that loving place. So, if people really want to talk to the trees they really have to open their hearts and mind.
I’m feeling very emotional. I’m also feeling a great deal of gratitude for you and what you do. And I’m not sure where all this emotion is coming from…
That’s OK, allow it through. For some reason this is a clearing. Did it come up with the native discussion?
It came up about 5 minutes ago when you first mentioned the trees and the stumps and some 800 year old oak trees.
Yes, some beautiful trees…
It’s kind of bittersweet.
For you to do this work, I’m getting to caution you – if you get so very caught up…It doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t allow yourself to feel – this is good. But you want to be very, very impersonal or you’re going to get caught up and get ungrounded and not able to do your work.
Yes, there are beautiful trees, but you know, nothing in life is permanent. Some beautiful old trees simply die in their own natural way. And that is beautiful. And then some get disrespected and some people value what they’re seeing and say, ‘hey this is an accomplishment. This tree is a total synergy in the environment. And a couple of kids have a great beautiful heart and the tree is doing great. And then people might saw half of it and then decide, oh, I better not do it. That happens too.
(The tape is interrupted with a portion of the interview that is conducted outside sitting by the big oak tree that is alone in a clearing. The sun is shining but it is somewhat chilly. In order not tt interrupt the flow, I used a portion of the tape that I had recorded on earlier…)
Viviane: (Translating for oak tree)
Oak tree says: you are loved.
Me? And her? (points to me)
Viviane: (she has her cheek against the tree. She feels & senses rather
than sees spirit)
All I’m getting is this incredible feeling of benevolence. Incredible peace.
Viviane translates for Oak Tree:
It is between things that we must keep our focus. That between man and tree. That between ourselves. Love is that which is between things. Be satisfied.
All that this tree wants to talk about is love. Be satisfied, know that you are loved. Love is all there is.
I was feeling this incredible radiation of love. And I was asking how do I convey that? And the answer was like, ‘that is exactly it, to be completely with the feeling and the being of it. He said it’s something that we just talk about.’
(Tree) I feel it like this breeze is blessing us at this time. “Be spacious. Look at the big picture. Trees watching us and we are all caught-up in small things, little things. While there’s a universe in little things…It’s good to have balance.
My heart tried to go towards a little sadness and the tree said to me,” there is no sadness in our hearts.”
When I listen to the wind I say I just want to be carried away as the breeze moving through the leaves. And the answer is, ”Ahhh, that is it.
I am a tree, I have to stand here but you can go flow with it,”
Are you a girl tree or a boy tree?
I am a man.
Viviane: (we laugh)
I’m sorry I called you a her. Excuse me – a man with attitude!
I don’t know if you feel this but all the nature here has been speaking to me about love. I have not felt one moment of fear, not one second of fear in this forest. (she speaks of the environment / woods where she lives)
It’s like, wake up and look at the horizon and realize you’re living in a community of people. But living in here, it’s been very peaceful. I walk out here at night all the time and I’ve been thinking I’ll come up here one night and just sit here all night with this tree. This tree is something special.
Does he have a name?
He says, “trees don’t have names, people have names.”
Is that what he said?
I don’t know but that’s what came to my heart.
We don’t need names, we have another way of recognizing each other. It’s more like a vibration. (Vivian is rubbing her fingers on his trunk )
( He says,) Ooo, I like that.!
I can’t explain it that I feel so much peace here. I asked if I’ve been on this land before –“yes, I have”.
I go to apache land and I feel tears pouring out of my eyes. I have had this thought that I want to come to this area, the Santa Cruz area for a long time; and find a way for it to happen.
And you know how we think about something for a long time and we don’t really do anything to actualize it and then it happens just like that. I think if I had any time here before it was very happy. And maybe I’ve changed because I know when I saw these bluffs outside of Phoenix I just thought – WOW! I could see that I had been there and it really called to me.
….It’s just that space, it’s just that emanation.
‘Now you’re going to come & keep me company and scratch my back’.
Linda: (we laugh)
Is that what he just said?
Yes, yes! That’s the way I like to talk with trees – they really like that tactile sensation. Think of it, these guys don’t go anywhere. They stay right there and wait until someone brushes up on them. Right?
(She tickles & pets the trunk & puts her check up too)
Does he have any advice on how to best represent trees to humans. ?
Hmm, I don’t know why I’m seeing a grid…(to tree) Do you have any advice on…?
Advice on how to relay the message of the trees to humans that we can become partners and can co-create rather than just destroy.
You’re not going to like this. (she relays this message to me) But destruction is part of the natural path.
(to the tree) When I saw the grid, was that something? Sort of like we’re all part of a pattern and we do our part. (waits for a reply)
“We trees here, we are happy. And whenever Viviane leaves we send her out to emanate this happiness to support our other trees! (we laugh)! I (Viviane) had that thought and I said, ‘do you really want me to say that’?
Tree: –Yeees. –(we laugh again)!